32 Responses to “Episode #3”

32 Comments

On the debate of user opinions taking part in how modmakers do their work, I think the limit should be very clear. Thinking from a mappers perspective, the idea of modmakers dedicating hours, months and even years of their lifes to the objective of pleasing some people and catering to their tastes more than the mapper’s own tastes sounds ridiculous. I can imagine real game studios doing this because their product will be sold for money, but amateur level designers get nothing from players besides criticism (sometimes harsh) and positive comments.
Sticking to a vision (if the vision is good enough) is sometimes the only thing that keeps a mod-maker motivated to go on. I don’t agree with the concept of the majority having anything to say about what I’m dedicating my private time to just because they are the majority.
That doesn’t mean level designers should ignore input and suggestions (a lot of good stuff comes out of feedback), but these shouldn’t change the roots of a map or mod unless the mapper or modder actually agrees with the proposed changes or additions.
As long as there’s a few people enjoying your work and your original vision, you have achieved your goal. The rest of those players can still play anything else they feel is better or adapts more to their tastes, because mods will only take your time (an infinitely smaller time than it takes from level designers to actually create the content), not your money.

I have listened since the pilot episode and I am enjoying the debates a lot.

Emanuel said about not releasing first maps. I disagree with this, if you don’t want to download it, then don’t. I would understand if you didn’t realise it was a first attempt, but you said you could see for yourself that it was.

This brings me to another thing. I don’t think gamers appreciate the huge amount of work that goes on to make a map. A good map will take several months to develop only to take half an hour to play. With maps in general gamers seem to be all ready to dish out criticism but seem to be short on good things to say about it. The same goes for modifications.

I am not saying you guys in particular but I am saying the general gaming community. One should appreciate all but the worst of maps, because, after all, it is free, ya know? It was nice to hear that nopk was watching the Formula 1, nice to see that you guys have interests out side of gaming ;=p ;=)

@PlanetPhilip

awesome then:)
and yeah webmasters are important to, if not the mod world would be a much more boring world :)
excting stuff like ModDB really stimulate the modding community;)

@DuckSauce,

We are not worried about running out of things to talk about, the reverse in fact. We often have to cut short conversation because of the time factor. We also plan to try and have at least one interview per transmission, as we have had so far. However, we made the conscious decision to also try and include webmasters because we feel they are an integral part of the community. It just happens that they have been 2 out of 3 so far. We will be contacting lots of mods teams in the future. You have no need to worry about the podcast becoming monthly.

@RawMeat3000,
The intro was us just having a bit of fun and trying to keep with the theme. We’ll probably change it soon to something more generic and shorter. Stay Tuned.

I’m liking these podcasts more and more every time I listen to them, and I’m definitely looking forward to the next episode. But honestly the intro is a bit cheesy.

I agree with discrate that you should just be doing the podcast, although i will say you did a decent job of doing both, there was some times you didn’t say anything but alteast there were no times that they asked you something and you didn’t know what they were talking about

@Discrete
It wasn’t an interview. I was a guest. I was merely there to offer my mis-informed American opinion to the show.

*discrate lol.

Doesnt matter, if your going to do an interveiw, do it. Dont go oh im watching something haha.

Listened when it came out, pretty good like usual,
First:
if you’re worried about running out of things to talk about I suggest 2 things:
Talk more in depth about mods that first come up, even if it’s been out for a while rather then saying, oh hey this or that mod has an update, this and that in it and then you move on.
I would like more details you know and while you won’t cover all the mods out there very quickly you will at least have stuff to talk about for many more episodes.

Ofcourse after you already discussed a mod in depth and it just has a minor update then there’s no reason anymore to discuss it in depth, but if it’s a minor update and you haven’t talked about it yet in a previous podcast then discuss it in more depth please:)

Secondly:
More interviews, I know it’s a bit about bringing news but you guys dont have to play every mod out there and who best can talk about the mods, both how it is, was and is gonna be then the developers?
I know it’s still early so it’s ok there isn’t much interviewing yet, but I bet there will be plenty developers willing to have an interview but they’re just to shy to ask xD;)

So yeah eh, I would love if the episode’s had more interviews with mod developers, like at least 1 per episode, if you can even 2.
And like I said earlier it’s ok if you can’t cover as many news and mods and stuff in one episode, cause it means you’ll have stuff to talk about in future episodes, if you go through it all to quickly then soon you will have to do monthly podcasts just to fill up the episodes and tbh I would hate that. Weekly is great and in a week not to much news goes on so more time spent on certain things would be good, just don’t lengthen on the epic discussions :P

Guys, i have something else for you to discuss.
if you go hear and look at the left 4 pic that first shows up. The 4 of them standing there
http://www.halflife2.net/left-4-dead

They all look different to what they are in the demo, the black guy has an afro which he doesnt in the demo. Francis has long hair, in the demo he doesnt. Zoe isnt wearing a pink jumper, and bill is wearing different colours too.

@Phillip, dont take it as proper rating as noobs just come and rate it stupidly.

Like i said in my previous comment. Structure what the podcast has, put everything in an order and keep it that way.

Some guest just rate the podcast 1 out of 5. I dislike it when visitors do that and not comment. Why not tell us what you didn’t like about it? Can’t give you want you want if we don’t know what that is.

Funny thing about nopk and I, we actually met on World of Warcraft probably about a year or more before I joined PHL’s staff. It’s a damned small world. I don’t have time to listen to the podcast right now but when I get home I surely will! Keep up the good work, you give hope to the oppressed citizens of City 17!

Thanks to everybody who has commented. As William has said please accept our apologies for the late posting of the podcast, a number of events transpired against us. It’s almost as if the Combine were trying to suppress us!

William and Nic worked very hard and I was in a dreamworld this week, so a big thanks to them.

@Mel,
Thanks for your comments. I understand your point about the mod news being a bit boring for you and share some of that sentiment. A lot of the mods are not really intersting to me but we have to appeal to as wide as possible an audience.

As you also mention it sometime sparks discussions that can be quite interesting.

@Discrate
Firstly, thanks for the comments. In reply to the points you raise:
1: We do try to select our guests very carefully. In this case it’s clear you don’t like nopk and that’s unfortunate. Nopk has forthright opinions (often wrong imho!) but some listeners like him (no accounting for taste huh!). It’s his second appearance and perhaps thought listeners already knew him. As to his watching F1 it was the end of season race and it helped decide the championship.

2: The podcast is very carefully structured. We have a detailed list of topics and they are grouped into sections. The problem is that discussions often go off topic and as hosts William and I have to decide at that moment whether to stop them or let them flow. Since we are both pretty new to this we sometimes get it wrong.

We have made available the agenda for the next transmission and it can be found here:
http://www.podcast17.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=8

It’s updated regularly but readers can’t post to it, yet. We may change that. It could be a good place to allow readers to suggest items like you have in the comments of this transmission.

3: Replying to comments. We have replied to comments in the podcast before and will do it again. The only problem is that not everybody has read the comments and that may cause misunderstandings. By replying to the comments in the comments we address the points directly but still have the option of replying in the podcast.

Although i looked and it hasn’t really been updated in awhile not sure what the deal with that is

oh and one more thing hahaha

@CubicVirtuoso how about replying to comments in the podcast? that would be great, just replying to comments, discussing what they have said etc.

First off guys, i like your pod casts.
But i have some feedback for you your podcasts.
1. Pick you guest speakers better. Who’s that twat who was on there who was suppose to be speaking but was watching the F1′s? when he introduced himself he sounded like a complete dickhead when hes just like “yo” lol.

2. Structure your pod cast better, have a set sequence of what is going to be talked about instead of everything just random. So at the start you might introduce everyone, then talk about the podcast news, then talk about what new mods are on the scene, then talk about steam updates instead of talking about everything all jumbled up.

Keep up the good work guys.

Hey all, thanks for listening to the latest episode we hoped you liked it!! Sorry for the lateness, our producer just got some brand new computer hardware and we were a little late with getting the episode out, but we hope you liked the audio quality and discussions.

Just a couple of things to catch up on:
- I ended up playing ZombieMaster and would like to say this mod is extremely fun, unfortunately it will loose a lot of players because of L4D Demo that came out this week.
- Also I just wanted you all to know that the FarCrab demo is for Half-Life 1, I’m not sure if I said Half-Life 2 on the podcast. Also this demo is absolutely amazing, really nice map work; although lots of reading, and unfortunately its all in french. C’est la vie.
- For some reason my EP2 is broken after playing Union; so I still haven’t gotten around to the Mirrors Edge Map; however it is on ModDB and is receiving a lot of attention.

Now onto comments:
@Walker: Thanks for all the kind words. I feel the same way you do; with so many games I find I don’t have the time to get through them all. I had a revelation yesterday, I might stop “trying” to play every AAA title and just stick to L4D and the Half-Life franchise for a while; we will see how this goes… well with the exception of Mirrors Edge and Little Big Planet… I’m such a video game addict.

@mel: Once again thanks for all the great comments. I hope this week a lot more people will have some things to say about the HL News. I know I can get really dry after a while, but I think it is all important things people should know about.

Loved the podcast guys, interesting topics resulting in good discussions. Well done! Added to my podcatching thingy.. this is a keeper.

I have to agree with Phillip i think for a single player experience to be good you have to come up with the story first. You guys brought up fallout, there’s no way that black isle made the game and then just before release said oh yeah lets decide our story real fast.

But on the other hand muli-player games don’t really need a story, there’s some that do and it works but over all they can just focus on the game play and let the player make up there own story in there head while playing. Haven’t all you CS players thought about why the terrorists are trying to blow up that room with all the boxes on dust?

Love the show keep it up

Just jotted down a few points about the show while still fresh in my mind:

The first section related to Game and Mod news was too long and a bit dull, if you are going to continue with this segment then better co-ordination between presenters is needed. Not a great deal of discussion was generated in this segment due to only one presenter knowing any thing about the mods covered. It took a good 30 minutes or more for any real debate to emerge, that being a good discussion on the value of a story-line, also a few of the later topics were constrained due to presenters not doing their homework.

I enjoyed Blinks contribution to the broadcast and felt I had learnt something, seems a great site for the ‘would be mapper’.

The Blast from the Past was spot-on with both presenters summarizing the mod to perfection, it’s not in my top five HL2 mods but worth a place in any ones top 20 and I hope this broadcast encourages others to go play it now.

Conclusion; I enjoyed all the discussions but except for Interlopers found the information portions a bit of a bore, much of which is better covered by the Links. But saying that who knows what items or topics are going to spark a debate on the night, you can over plan these things.

Thanks for the show and keep up the good work.

The idea of strictly adhering to what your fans are saying, purely because they are the majority, is a completely outrageous statement. A mod developer has creative jurisdiction over his work — as do all involved — and it is their driving vision that is the singular most important aspect. The majority of people, as we are shown in all aspects of life, do not know what they are talking about. What is a mod if it is dictated by what the fans are clamoring for? I am with Philip on this one but I would argue that the website analogy only works in the wider context – ultimately, game design is so incredibly different, and the whole idea of molding a game based on the dictations of a bunch of people who don’t make and don’t test them is utterly laughable.

But hey, good stuff – keep the podcasts coming.

First of all, I have to say that you gays are doing something very interesting.

I’ve known of this podcast in planethalfilfe 2 or 3 day after the 1st one. And I’ve heard about planetphillip for the 1st in the pocast. And after checking it out I realized how much i’ve been missing about the half life and the mod community, Essentially due to lack of time.

And that takes to what you guys discussed about to much mod offers. I think that’s a general game industry problem. There are so many games, so many mods, so many maps. It’s impossible to keep track of everything. I mean, I usually buy afew games a year that I know I’m going to enjoy and I’m sure I’ll have the time to play them, and I download few ones that I want to check out, and if I like them I Buy them (happened with FEAR, Stalker and Crysis, If I haven’t tryed, I wouldn’t have bought them. I think demo’s should be mandatory). But even so, From last year and this year I have about a dozen games that I downloaded and deleted them without even installing them because I didn’t have time to play them, and now there are a dozen other games I’d like to try. There are so many games looking interesting to try, like fallout 3, I’m really looking forward to see Mirror’s edge, I still want to try both X3 games. There’s GTA IV to PC (I don’t have consoles). There’s FEAR 2 coming in February. And I’m still not sure of Left 4 dead, But I’ll defenetly play the demo. And there are just my most wanted games. I still have Stalker Clear sky to explore. And a ton of mods that i downloaded form planephillip. When do I get to play all this? And I bet there’s a lot more people that has to make choices like this, what to play, what to leave behind.

Phillip, I read your post in your website forum about mirror’s edge in the source engine. I thought about it for a while but decided not to comment because I’m still not sure what to think about the game itself, though I’m very looking forward to play it. And about the comment you guys made about porting it and the remakes of other games in the source engine, I think there’s intelectual property issues envolved. Although it could very interesting…

I think this comment goes for Emanuel: There’s people (me, for example) that uses sites like planethalflife to check out what’s going on, not just to find out when a game gets released.

Keep up the good work guys.